“We’re at a point in our society today where women finally have a voice, and the more we continue to fight for that, it shows in the sports world,” says New York Liberty guard Sabrina Ionescu, the 2020 number one overall WNBA draft pick, three-time all-star, and member of the current USA women’s Olympic basketball team. “The growth of the WNBA over the last five years has been tremendous; this year’s rookies—Angel Reese, Caitlin Clark, Cameron Brink—have entered the league at an all-time high. And they’ve helped the league’s popularity grow by bringing their college fans with them. People are starting to see, if you invest in women at a young age, you can see it’s a good product.”

Here, Ionescu talks with Lisa Robinson about the WNBA’s fight for social justice and women’s rights, her competitive spirit, that three-point shooting contest with Steph Curry, her friendship with Kobe Bryant, and how she was told as a child not to play sports with boys and to instead “play with dolls.”

Lisa Robinson: You got married last March [to Las Vegas Raiders center Hroniss Grasu]; you’re basically a newlywed. How do you juggle your personal life with the WNBA season?

Sabrina Ionescu: It’s been a part of our relationship since we started dating my last year in college [the University of Oregon], so it’s something we’re used to. His playing football helps a little bit; because our seasons don’t 100% overlap, he’s been able to see my games as well. It’s good to have that perspective of being married to another athlete. It keeps me levelheaded.

Before all the current hubbub about Caitlin Clark, you were an outstanding college player and a number one pick in the WNBA. Do you think the ascent of the W has a lot to do with stars like you and A’Ja Wilson; Kobe Bryant’s interest in women’s and girls basketball; those awful photos of the women’s accommodations in the pandemic bubble compared to the men’s; Brittney Griner’s incarceration in Russia; or all of the above?

The growth has been tremendous. I think TV ratings were up 42% last year from the year before, and that was before a lot of these new players came into the league. It’s been a long time coming because so many great players laid down the foundation for us to get to where we’re at today. Visibility, attendance, and being on TV all plays a huge role in the interest in the women’s game. It’s a movement: We’ve been able to see it in women’s soccer, and now we’re seeing it in basketball. People are starting to see how fun our games are, and also women finally—well, maybe not have a seat at the table, but we have a voice in the sports world.

Well, women can thrive in sports or business, but men are still telling us what we can do with our bodies.

That’s something we all talk about as a union and as a team. It’s appalling to me that 4 out of 12 teams in the W don’t have those [women’s reproductive] rights in their state. As a union and a league, we continue to try to use our voices and resources to fight for what’s right. It’s hard because there are so many opinions and views, but at the end of the day, I believe that we’ve always been at the forefront of change. When we collectively use our voices, we see change in specific communities. Especially with the election coming up, we are going to have to figure out ways to amplify our voices—to be heard and to see the change we want to see.

Despite the racially harmonious nature of the WNBA, I’ve heard from several players that issues and conflicts exist between the Black and white players, and the straight and queer players. Have you found that to be true?

I haven’t seen it or been a part of it. What I always try to promote is to see everyone succeed. I want to lift everyone up, and the hard part is, society tears people down, and social media is awful. I never want to be the person who tears anyone down. I had a season-ending injury in 2020 and wasn’t able to be in the bubble, but to see how the W was at the forefront of a lot of protest and change [following the killings of George Floyd and Breonna Taylor]—we weren’t afraid of the repercussions. We were ahead of the NBA and the NFL.

Everyone is ahead of the NFL.

Yes, but we stood on what we believed, and I think that speaks a lot to the power that women have. Being able to not care—we’re just unapologetically ourselves and don’t care what everyone else has to say.

You grew up idolizing some of the women you’ve had to play against.You’ve played against Sue Bird; you play against Diana Taurasi [and are now on the USA Olympic team with her]; Becky Hammon is coaching against your team. What’s that like?

It took a little bit of an adjustment, because I was kind of in awe the first time I stepped on the court and played against Diana. It took a bit of time because the first year I was hurt, so it took me time to really share the court with her.

This year you gave a sort of “welcome to the W,” Michael Jordan–esque shrug to Caitlin Clark when you faked a three-pointer on her. Diana has a bit of a reputation. Did she ever do anything like that to you when you were a rookie?

Not really. She wasn’t too bad. We played against each other [when I was] at Oregon, when Team USA did their college tour. That was like a pinch-me moment. I was doing my best not to geek out. I was trying to win. I think at the beginning of my career, I had to find a balance with the players I watched growing up. Then, just having to shift my mind to, I’m going to win, and get locked in and focused on that.

How prevalent is the trash talk in the WNBA?

I don’t think there’s that much, but if you do banter, it’s like this huge deal. In the NBA, that happens with your own teammates in practice. In women’s sports, everything is supposed to be so PG, you can’t go back and forth. I grew up playing with guys, and I know there’s a double standard. But it’s changing; there’s trash talk, banter, rivalries between players. And with more media coverage now, you see it more.

What about this whole WNBA “’fits”—all the fashion coverage? The tunnel runway is like a red carpet at every game. Is this now something you have to plan and think about in addition to everything else?

It’s something I’m really not used to, because I just love to show up and play. I don’t really focus too much on what I’m wearing. Being in New York—the biggest market—has kind of changed that in terms of being able to express yourself the way you want. It’s been a part of the WNBA for the past couple of years; you get to see players step outside the court and be who they want to be in terms of what they wear. It’s definitely been a bit of a shift. In college, you just show up to the game in sweatpants and a sweatshirt.

Do you have to do glam—hair and makeup?

I don’t do hair and makeup before a game. Some people do.

Did people really tell you you should “play with dolls” when you played ball with your brothers growing up?

Yes, in middle school. But it made me so competitive. I don’t like to lose at anything. Card games. I’d rather not play. I usually don’t play any games with my husband because I want to keep peace in the house. I was an awful loser in high school and college; I think I lost, like, five times in high school. I wouldn’t talk for a week. You couldn’t speak to me at home; I wouldn’t talk to my family…. It was so bad, because I’d never really experienced it.

What was it like being the number one pick, being called a “generational talent,” and then having an injury derail your entire first year?

It was tough. Being the college player that I was, I entered the league with a target on my back. It was like all eyes on me, a lot of pressure and expectations. I didn’t have a draft, I was home during the pandemic, my season got cut short, and all I had worked for my whole college career was to prove myself in this league. So getting hurt three games in was awful. I landed on an ankle and had to get surgery. I had never had an injury like that, and it taught me patience. The team was in the bubble and I knew if I went, I wouldn’t be able to leave. I came to New York to get surgery, then went back home to California. When you’re the number one pick, you go to the worst team. You move away from your family; you have to figure out how to lose—you have less grace. No one says, “Oh, she’s a rookie, give her time.” No one cares. You’re 21, and you’re playing against 37-, 38-year-old women who’ve played in this league for 19, 20 years. I was playing Sue Bird, who entered the league the year I was born. I’m playing adults, and I’m a child. I had to grow into my own and just figure it out.

Then your second year, you came back too soon?

I rushed back into playing. New York was so excited to have the number one pick, and I felt I had let my team down. Plus, I let all the media scrutiny get into my head and it took a huge toll on me. I wasn’t 100% and I almost had to have a second reconstructive surgery; I was playing in pain.

How do people play in pain? Do they just shoot you up with stuff?

I would get, like, five injections. I tried everything. But the hard part was battling the negativity I received from the rest of the league and social media. I used to read the comments a lot more, and I was pushing myself to prove I belonged in the league. It just taught me that I had to run my own race and not focus on what everyone around me was saying. Now that I’m back, I feel blessed that I went through an injury like that so early in my career. It set me up for my future as a professional athlete.

I’m friendly with [point guard] Chris Paul, and everyone calls him a “point god.” Explain to me what you do as a point guard.

I think I’ve changed the narrative a bit; I’m not a traditional point guard. I shoot, I pass, but Chris Paul is a conductor on the floor. He sets everyone up; he calls the play; he knows where everyone needs to go. The game is more positionless now. Steph Curry changed the game in terms of shooting.

The three-point competition you and Steph did at last year’s NBA All-Star weekend was the highlight of the weekend. Are you going to do it again?

We haven’t decided. Seeing how great the first one went, obviously we talk about it all the time. We were both nervous. Anytime you’re doing something for the first time, it provides room for error, and in the back of our minds we were thinking, This can’t go bad. We felt the pressure. We’re in different leagues, but we were both trying to accomplish the same thing: equality. Doing that through a shooting competition and knowing there were so many young girls out there glued to the TV or in the stands—55,000 people came to watch—we wanted to go out and show that this is the right way to do things.

It wasn’t a circus like that 1973 Billie Jean King–Bobby Riggs “battle of the sexes.”

No, we were locked in. We practiced beforehand, and afterward we felt it was only two rounds; we were just getting warmed up. It should have been more.

Maybe if we do it again, we could think of how we want to do it. There were a million reasons not to do it—the fear of failure—but it just shows the courage of doing it, and that hug we had afterward was just pride and relief. I was happy he won.

He only won by one shot. What if you won? I think he would have been pissed.

I don’t know…I felt like I already won. Just by going out there and doing it.

You live in Brooklyn; do people bother you in New York? In one of your CarMax ads, you run away on the street, pretending it’s not you. Are you like that if people come up to you on the street?

I’m pretty nice. Playing in New York, there are so many famous people, and New Yorkers are cool; they’re on their way to do their own things. But it has taken me a little while to get used to it, because even after the three-point contest with Steph last year, people yell at me, “You should have won!”

I’m a major Knicks fan, and I saw that Jalen Brunson wore your shoe the night he scored 50 points. Do 77 NBA players really wear your shoe—the Sabrina 1?

Yes, and a woman having a unisex shoe had never been done before. That was what my goal was: to see everyone in them—not just NBA players, but college and high school players too. A woman can always buy a man’s shoe and just convert the size over; that’s what everyone does. But I wanted to see everyone and anyone in them, and I accomplished that. With the Sabrina 2 shoe, the technology is different, but I just wanted it to be a new-and-improved version of the 1, because that did so well—and if it’s not broke, don’t fix it.

With all the excitement and attention surrounding the WNBA now, the teams can finally fly on private flights, but didn’t the Liberty do that last year?

Yes, illegally. But transitioning into charter flights has been amazing. It’s been something we’ve been pushing for for a long time. It just takes such a toll on your body, having to sit in an airport for a really long time; not being able to leave after a game; having to stay overnight and leave the next day—and that’s supposed to be your off day—then prepare for the next game. Now, with good hotels and charter flights, it’s going to be exciting to see how the play on the court improves.

But the highest annual salary in the W is around $252,000, which is nothing compared to what the men make. What if you’d had the NIL [the ability for college players to profit from the use of their name, image, and likeness] when you were at Oregon?

I would have made a lot of money. I missed it by one year. Now I need my endorsements. But when I was in college, I was just focused on winning. We were all poor; it was part of the college experience. I graduated in three years, then got my masters in brand responsibility. I’m not sure I would have been able to do that if I’d had to juggle the NIL too—all that marketing, it’s a job.

John McEnroe once told me that no matter how down he was in a match, he still thought he could win. Do you feel that way in a game?

I never expect to lose. The rude awakening of joining a team that [initially] wasn’t at the top of the league taught me how to learn from losses. You don’t make every shot, you can’t win every game, but all that made me keep practicing, because I don’t ever want to lose.

I was at the last game of the finals last year when [the Liberty] lost to the Las Vegas Aces by one point.

It was awful, it was rough. I had never been in the finals before; everything was moving too fast. I didn’t know what level of composure you need to be in the finals. But I think knowing I was getting married later that year—I waited until after the season to plan the wedding—that definitely helped. If we make it to the finals this year, there won’t be the element of surprise.

How did you feel seeing those photos of Brittney Griner incarcerated in that Russian prison?

It was tough, knowing she’s one of us; she’s part of our league. You don’t want to see anyone go through that. Obviously, only she knows what she went through and how bad it was. But I mean…it’s Russia.

You were friends with Kobe [Bryant] and you were one of the people who spoke at his memorial. Is it true that he showed you a step-back shot?

We had worked out together a few times, and he came to visit me when [Oregon] played in LA. He had such attention to detail, just all the small fundamental things: the footwork, the arc of your shot when you fadeaway —all those minute details that play into being one of the greatest basketball players in the world, which he was. I was like a sponge, just trying to listen, super into the kind of details that I obsess over. I love being able to learn and take it all in.

What is your SI20 Foundation?

The goal is to create camps and access to sports; just give back to kids in underserved communities, both boys and girls. Being able to use my platform to inspire the next generation. I didn’t want to wait to do it when I was 35; I wanted to start this while I was young.

You have so many stats, so many records, accomplishments, awards, and you’re on the USA women’s Olympic basketball team for the first time. What are you most proud of?

Being drafted number one was one of my greatest accomplishments. And even graduating college. My twin brother and I were the first generation to go to college and graduate. My parents grew up in a communist country, and knowing what they went through—to see our success here is something beyond their wildest dreams. [Editor’s note: Ionescu’s father won a lottery to emigrate from Romania to the US, then six years later his wife and oldest son joined him in America.] Knowing how proud they are makes me the most happy. Also, it has always been a dream of mine to represent our country at the Olympics. As for stats—for me, obviously to have set the record in college for triple doubles for men and women.

Is it still a record?

Yes. By a landslide.

What’s your next goal?

To win a championship.