The Secrets Behind Casting the 'House of the Dragon' Actors

He's like a jazz musician when he is sort

of scatting around.

It's a real joy.

And we started to see that his version

of Daemon was actually the most profound version

that we needed for the story

that we were building at that point.

[dramatic music]

Hi, Vanity Fair. I'm Kate Rhodes James.

I'm the casting director of House of the Dragon.

And today I'm going to let you into some of my secrets of

how we put it all together.

Game of Thrones was the most sensationally successful

TV show I think of all time.

I think a lot of that success was primarily down

to the genius of the casting.

And so that was a very tall order to follow.

I wanted to challenge everyone's preconceptions

about these roles, and I think that's also part of

what a casting director should do,

is to say, Yes, that could work.

But what if we went that way?

[dramatic music]

Rhaenyra she needed to be somebody that was unusual,

fiercely intelligent.

I didn't want her to be this sort of doe-eyed girl

that we see on television a lot.

You've gotta think about your audience

that's gonna spend the next five years with this character,

and you need an actor that's going to evolve.

I found Emma through theater

and I was fascinated by them.

I would call them in for many auditions

and they always did something unique.

Something so unique, you would...

I'd spend, you know,

a whole day hearing the scene being done, you know, well,

and then Emma would come in,

and it was like they would find elements of a scene

that no one had even seen, let alone noticed.

And it never felt like acting.

So I was like on a mission to find the right thing for them.

It was very exciting when I introduced them

to Ryan and Miguel.

They had read along with many, many other actresses,

and I remember sending it, the link, to them in California

and thinking, Okay, this is gonna go two ways.

These are either my people or possibly not my people.

And they immediately came back

and said, There's only one person.

And that was Emma, which was a huge relief,

because then I knew I was with the people creatively

that I could go on this very, very long journey with.

Milly Alcock is an actress

who I had already known her work.

I'd seen her in an Australian show called Upright

and thought she was just spectacular.

What you do is you ask for younger pictures of the actresses

'cause it guides you.

And then I suddenly, halfway through the process,

suddenly thought, Hang on a minute,

Milly put her picture next to Emma.

It was a shape of the face, obviously the color of the eyes,

but also Milly's little renegade, as is Emma.

Their energies are very, very similar.

It just is that free spirit.

It's that wild intellect and fierceness.

You know, even when Milly is just the cupbearer

with her father, she is a presence

and a already a force.

And I always already knew I was going to get that from Emma.

So it's making sure you marry those up.

She did an audition.

It was really chaotic, which added to the fun of it.

She was living at home with her mom.

She was in an attic in Sydney.

It was very early for me, very late for her.

We worked a lot together on a Zoom,

and it was, again, it was her energy

and I knew that was what would appeal to everybody.

It didn't matter that the flat was maybe a bit chaotic.

It sort of added to her charm

and to who Milly was then, not now,

but then as a hugely enthusiastic characterful young woman.

[dramatic music]

Olivia Cooke, very experienced actress.

She'd been acting since she was very, very young

and somebody I'd never got to work with

and had always wanted to.

Right from the get go again, self tape,

kind of knocked it outta the park.

She auditioned also for Rhaenyra.

Both the reads were spectacular,

but it was really clear that she was suited to Alicent.

And I can't explain to you why,

because it's just an instinctive thing.

And then the joy of having Emma

and Olivia spark off each other.

You hope that happens. You don't know.

I was watching actually in the scene

between the two girls, Rhaenyra and Alicent,

but Rhaenyra realizes that Alicent made a mistake.

It's just an extraordinary performance.

That's a real honor to be around actors as talented

and as clever as that.

[dramatic music]

For Olivia, finding the younger version

of her was slightly easier than Emma

simply because Olivia's got, you know,

that beautiful dark brown hair and those big brown eyes.

And we did a big open call, again virtually,

but at this stage it was ultimately who was going

to feel like the young version of Olivia,

but also who, you know,

these are two lambs to the slaughter.

So there's a vulnerability.

Emily just sort of wafted in

with this incredible sort of glow and charm,

and innocence about her that was completely

and utterly engaging for what we needed

from Alicent at that time.

You know, Alicent was always the good girl.

She was always sort of saying, Oh, Rhaenyra,

stop doing that and put that away

and stop laughing too much.

Stop talking too loudly.

And they, again, they just worked it out beautifully.

So we were really blessed in those situations.

You just got to make sure you cover everything

and just pray that they're out there.

[dramatic music]

Matt Smith, an extraordinary actor, really, really,

really brought it to the table.

Daemon has no redeeming features and that's a good thing.

I think that's fun to play.

I mean, you know, in that first series,

he's seducing his niece,

he's at the whore house every five seconds.

He's completely out of control and vicious with it.

I knew in my heart of hearts that Matt can play that.

Most of what he had done up to that point,

there had been sympathetic side to him

and we needed to not see that.

We needed not to have any sense of, you know, really,

really just go for it.

So we asked him in for an audition

and he was fun, you know, was phenomenal.

He came in, I had to read with him,

which was somewhat mortifying for him, but we did it.

And he just went with it.

He's like a jazz musician when he's sort of scatting around

and it's just, it's a real joy.

And we started to see that his version

of Daemon was actually the most profound version

that we needed for the story

that we were building at that point.

It was extraordinary.

It was just extraordinary

and it was just a slam dunk at that point.

He was our Daemon.

And it's funny because I can't think of anybody else

that I even considered for that role.

They're just gone, I can't remember.

I think the easy way to have gone with Daemon,

which wouldn't have been nearly as interesting,

would've been to get some, you know,

big muscly thug of an actor.

That would've been boring.

You want the complexities, you want someone

who can physically be that person, which Matt does,

but equally be able to navigate

those different relationships between the ones

that he has with his brother, with his niece,

with his aunt, all of that.

And that is where Matt is so spectacularly skillful.

I think this is an incredibly brilliant platform for him.

[dramatic music]

Ewan Mitchell, you know, I knew Ewan a bit

from his previous work,

but I didn't know him for forensically

and he obviously stood out

for quite a striking looking young man and an intensity.

And when he gave us that, my word,

it was quite something else.

And that essence, having an actor that's gonna be

that brave and fearless, that's what House the Dragon

and Game of Thrones is all about,

is having fearless actors.

So he really, really turned it up a huge notch.

There was just an other worldliness.

They don't disappear, they all stand out.

And he had to get great buildup

with the fantastic Leo Ashton

who played the younger version of him

with the loss of the eye.

That fight scene with those kids,

I still think is just phenomenal.

I mean, it's the first time I've seen children fighting

like adults, which is what they were trained to do.

They said, we're not gonna teach you to fight like children.

We're gonna teach you to fight like adults,

which made that scene all the more shocking

in season one.

So Leo again had sowed the seeds

so magnificently for Ewan to then come in

and with his eye patch

and all of those spectacular visuals that he had,

he didn't have much to do.

He was just being established in season one.

But season two, my God, it brings fun to it as well,

which makes it even more enjoyable.

[dramatic music]

Matthew Needham actually is a great example

of another extraordinarily fascinating actor

who I've worked with quite a lot.

And if you'd bring in people like Matthew,

some directors wouldn't know what to do with him.

But the really, really,

really brilliant directors have really,

really hit the floor running with him.

I mean, I had him in Napoleon,

he played Joaquin Phoenix's brother in Napoleon,

and Joaquin absolutely adored him

because Matthew sits back, he just sits back

and he watches, he's a watcher and he's absorber.

And those, of course are the most fascinating people.

He doesn't need to try too much,

he's already worked out why this person is the way he is.

He's not just playing someone

with a clubfoot who's got some axe to grind.

So that's when I say to actors, you know, and it's hard

'cause a lot of the time they don't get scripts

or they get dummy sides.

I always say, make a decision about the character,

bring it into the room.

And every time I've seen an actor do that,

I see the director move forward and go,

Okay, great, that was wonderful, but let's go again

and we'll try something else.

If you walk into the room and expecting us to sort

of give it to you, it doesn't succeed so well.

[dramatic music]

Tom's just a spectacular actor who I had seen

in a Jez Butterworth play at the Royal Court.

He came on to one of my all-time favorite songs,

which was Teenage Kicks by The Undertones,

and he danced with such ferocity, his foot,

he was wearing Doc Martens and he was stamping and stamping

and stamping on the stage and the stage was wobbling.

And I just thought, Look at that commitment, that passion,

that ferocity.

I was completely besotted with him as an actor.

I had been determined to find something.

So when we were casting this, I do remember saying to Ryan

and Miguel, I know exactly who's gonna play this.

And I said, I'm not gonna say his name

because I don't want you to be pressurized,

but I have exactly the perfect actor to play this role.

And it was Tom.

[dramatic music]

I've known Steve for years, accustomed to many things,

Line of Duty, and I've seen a lot of his theater.

It was a joy actually to be able to put Steve front

and center because everything that he was doing

he was doing so brilliantly.

But he was never really giving those lead roles

on camera and to give him a lead role, which, you know,

they all are leading characters.

It was real joy and he's loving every minute of it.

But he and Eve Best are just spectacular together.

And they look after each other.

And again, that's part of the process,

making sure that you're getting personalities

that are going to...

'Cause those performances will only grow

when you have somebody that's going to let you

become the fertile land.

It's lines like, you know,

Rhaenys the Queen that never was.

I mean, that says everything.

That's a lifetime of frustration, of loss,

of never getting what she wanted,

of always being second best.

And I think that's profoundly inspiring.

So that's what led me on that road for say, Rhaenys.

I mean, it's a gift.

It's a complete gift to work on a show like this.

I'm immensely proud of it.

I'm immensely proud of every single person in it.

They've all taken on this huge responsibility.

And it wasn't easy.

You know, we shot the first series in lockdown, you know,

they went from their locked in homes

and into a locked in studio in Watford.

But there's a real sense

of camaraderie amongst everybody.

And I think that's essential.